pending court case re: accused of driving while talking on a phone

S

steve1234

Registered User
Messages
60
Hi
ive got a court case comming up soon.
ive been accused of driving while talking on a phone. The problem is i wasent but how can i prove it. I was driving along with the window down and my arm was on the side door and i was resting my head on my hand.
When the garda stopped me i totally denied it and was in shock - i though i did something else like run a red light or something. anyways i asked him to check my phone to see if there were any incomming or out going calls or texts and he wouldnt. Then he said you dont have to be actually making any calls just holding it is enough.
Then i asked my rights - as in can i refuse to accept the ticket - he said no - "Its the cart before the horse - you have to take the ticket and not pay it then prove in court that you didnt do it"
So here i am with a pending court case.
I asked him to write down the exact time i was stopped - so i can contact my phone company to detail a list of all incomming and out going calls at the time.
What other evidence can i bring??
Can i ask to do a lie detector test- Will they have these in the court?
Also im driving on a UK licience. Im irish but used to live in the UK for 3 years. Im back living in ireland for the last 3 years.
Should i have changed my licience over to an irish one by now? Will this matter?
I would of happily paid the fine and took the points if i did it but its the princible of the whole thing. Its going to cost me alot more to take a day off work than pay the fine and Ive better things to be doing than playing space invaders while driving a car.
Thanks,
Steve
 
steve1234 said:
Hi
ive got a court case comming up soon.
ive been accused of driving while talking on a phone. The problem is i wasent but how can i prove it. I was driving along with the window down and my arm was on the side door and i was resting my head on my hand.
When the garda stopped me i totally denied it and was in shock - i though i did something else like run a red light or something. anyways i asked him to check my phone to see if there were any incomming or out going calls or texts and he wouldnt. Then he said you dont have to be actually making any calls just holding it is enough.
Then i asked my rights - as in can i refuse to accept the ticket - he said no - "Its the cart before the horse - you have to take the ticket and not pay it then prove in court that you didnt do it"
So here i am with a pending court case.
I asked him to write down the exact time i was stopped - so i can contact my phone company to detail a list of all incomming and out going calls at the time.
What other evidence can i bring??
Can i ask to do a lie detector test- Will they have these in the court?
Also im driving on a UK licience. Im irish but used to live in the UK for 3 years. Im back living in ireland for the last 3 years.
Should i have changed my licience over to an irish one by now? Will this matter?
I would of happily paid the fine and took the points if i did it but its the princible of the whole thing. Its going to cost me alot more to take a day off work than pay the fine and Ive better things to be doing than playing space invaders while driving a car.
Thanks,
Steve
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I don't know if having your head resting on your hand while driving one handed will be the best defence, could you be done for dangerous driving instead?. Is it not a whole lot easier to swallow the bitter pill.
 
No its not easier to swallow the bitter pill and its too late for that now.
Im sure the garda is right 95% of the time but this time he was wrong.
 
steve1234 said:
....he said you dont have to be actually making any calls just holding it is enough. ...
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The problem with this is it becomes his word against yours. I would guess that the only chance you would have is if you rarely use your phone, and hadn't made any calls/text for a long time before being stopped. I might only make 2 or 3 calls in a day for example, and 2 or 3 texts. Then you would have no reason to be holding your phone. Whereas if you use it constantly, then I'm guessing you'll have no chance.
 
steve1234 said:
No its not easier to swallow the bitter pill and its too late for that now.
Im sure the garda is right 95% of the time but this time he was wrong.
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Ok then take your chance and be ready for the very real possibility of a higher fine and increased points penalty.
 
Consult with a solicitor who will liase with your mobile service provider in obtaining your phone records to assist in proving/disproving the allegation and who make representation in court on your behalf
 
McCrack said:
Consult with a solicitor who will liase with your mobile service provider in obtaining your phone records to assist in proving/disproving the allegation and who make representation in court on your behalf
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But hasn't the guard already said that it doesn't matter if he was actually using the phone, he had it in his hand (as he incorrectly saw it) so phone records won't achieve anything.
 
Go to court and show this guy up for the idiot he obviously is. Phone records should be enough to prove your innocence if you didn't have any outgoing or incoming calls around that time. Point out the fact that he refused to check your phone effectively forcing his authority on you. Why would you be holding your phone to your head if you're not making a call?...madness! It's about time people stood up to this sort of nonsense.
 
Trent said:
Go to court and show this guy up for the idiot he obviously is. Phone records should be enough to prove your innocence if you didn't have any outgoing or incoming calls around that time. Point out the fact that he refused to check your phone effectively forcing his authority on you. Why would you be holding your phone to your head if you're not making a call?...madness! It's about time people stood up to this sort of nonsense.
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I agree that if he wasn't in the wrong he shouldn't be punished but sometimes you are better off taking the lesser of two evils. The guard could argue that the op was about to make a call, he might be lucky and the guard won't turn up though which is a possibility.
 
MrMan said:
...but sometimes you are better off taking the lesser of two evils...
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I'm not having a go, but it's this sort of attitude that's to blame for this sort of situation. If more people stood up to this sort of rubbish, then maybe the courts would take notice.
 
Well you can forget about the lie detector test anyway, although I would actually pay to hear that one in the local district court...

As others have advised, get your mobile phone records, employ a solicitor. Your solicitor will get on to the inspector handling the list the day before the court and will advise that it will be contested and that the records will be produced in court. The inspector may even agree to strike it out on that basis. If not, then the guard will give his evidence, you will give your evidence, the records will be handed in and the judge will decide on the basis of the evidence in front of her/him.

It is not uncommon for a judge to decide there is a reasonable doubt. Of course you run the risk of losing and adding solicitors fees to a fine. And even if you win, you must still pay a solicitor their fee. Looking at it on a strictly monetary basis you may be on a loser, however I agree that sometimes it is important to stand up for what is right.
 
ok thanks - i was thinking of not employing a solicitor and just representing myself. would this be a bad idea? I never been inside a courtroom so i dont know what to expect.
 
steve1234 said:
ok thanks - i was thinking of not employing a solicitor and just representing myself. would this be a bad idea? I never been inside a courtroom so i dont know what to expect.
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Entirely up to yourself, you have every right to represent yourself.
 
steve1234 said:
ok thanks - i was thinking of not employing a solicitor and just representing myself. would this be a bad idea? I never been inside a courtroom so i dont know what to expect.
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Yes, would be a bad idea if you've never been inside a courtroom and its not a clear cut case from the Judges point of view.
 
...especially as you have already outlined the details of your case, and your proposed defence, on a public website with 36,292 registered members :)
 
Vanilla's post (no.11) is spot on. Essentially the Judge must be satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that you were using a mobile whilst driving. If you plead not guilty the Garda must prove to the court that you were. Now all he can say is he saw you whereas you can say you werent AND have your mobile phone records as supporting evidence to this, so it's not a simple situation of your word against a members word.

That in my opinion would raise a reasonable doubt sufficient to acquit you.

I would strongly advise you consult a solicitor, expect to pay around €300 for his/her services (to include attendance in court)

(O and merely having a mobile in your hand whilst driving is not to my knowledge an offence)
 
Ok thanks for the advice- i might just get a solicitor now.
Looks like this is going to cost more than I thought but worth it in the end.
 
Trent said:
I'm not having a go, but it's this sort of attitude that's to blame for this sort of situation. If more people stood up to this sort of rubbish, then maybe the courts would take notice.
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I understand your point, but surely there are times to take a stand and times to let sometihing go and move on. This situation represents a case where a guard made a genuine error that has little consequence to the injured party, how often do you think people come up with excuses that are actually false? I would think it was the liars that create situations like the one being discussed. I don't know if my earlier point has any relevance but the fact that the driver was driving with one hand (like a lot of us do) whilst resting his head on his other hand might not be in his favour either.
 
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