Health Insurance Fair Deal Scheme Questions.

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Gerdoy

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Hello,new on here so apologies if this is misplaced.

My Mother in law,suffering from Alzheimers, has been resident in a Nursing Home for 5 years now under the FD scheme.

It appears her care cost is €1,015 per week
From what we know,my Father-in law has been paying a contribution of €1,015 per MONTH as the assessed top-up to her FD amount,and did NOT apply for the FD Loan Scheme.

Sadly,my Father-in-law has now suffered a stroke,and after several months in hospital has been admitted to the same Nursing Home as his wife (shared room).
His application for FD assistance has now been approved,but with almost double the contribution he pays for his wife.
This will be a very difficult figure to provide going forward.
From my cursory read of the HSE letter,it appears that the valuation on their house (c.€300,000) is being loaded significantly against his application.
As we try to get an understanding of how this system operates,are there any elements of the FD scheme I am missing,specifically with reference to a Married Couple now being catered for,albeit at a 5 year remove ?
 
I always thought that in the case of a couple, half of the combined value of income/assets were used in the assessment, however I'm not clear if the cap which applies if only one person is in a nursing home and one person living at home still applies

try here for more info
http://www.hse.ie/nhss/#fin
 
Gerdoy said:
His application for FD assistance has now been approved,but with almost double the contribution he pays for his wife.
This will be a very difficult figure to provide going forward.
Click to expand...

Your Mother in Laws assessed contribution of €1,015 monthly would now be based on half their income and assets, other than the family home, as the family home would have been disregarded after 3 years. She would have been paying a lot more for the first three years.

As your Father in Law is only entering care now his contribution would be assessed on half their income and assets, including the family home for the first three years., thereafter only on income and assets other than the family home.

7.5% of his half of the family home is €11,250 annually, or €937 monthly. Your Father in Laws contribution should be this much more than your Mother in Laws for the first three years.

Did your Mother in Law ever have her contribution reassessed ?, you can request this annually. Particularly as they did not apply for the Fair Deal Loan, if savings were used to fund her contribution, it’s likely these savings have dropped considerably. In our cases each time we applied to be reassessed we got a significant reduction.

There is nothing to stop you at any stage applying for the Fair Deal Loan for the portion of your Father in Laws contribution that is based on his half of the family home, this would improve their cash flow by €937 monthly for the three years it applied. It would have to be repaid when the family home is eventually sold.
 
As twofor1 states, the contribution in respect of your MIL should have dropped significantly after 3 years and as savings are run down. Also, it would be preferable to defer paying the 7.5% of half of the value of the home until the home is sold, which should not be during their lifetimes as the cash would then be included in both of their assessments.

A revised assessment should be sought in respect of MIL and then FIL after 3 years and annualy thereafter as long as income/assets reduces annually.
 
Slim said:
As twofor1 states, the contribution in respect of your MIL should have dropped significantly after 3 years and as savings are run down. Also, it would be preferable to defer paying the 7.5% of half of the value of the home until the home is sold, which should not be during their lifetimes as the cash would then be included in both of their assessments.

A revised assessment should be sought in respect of MIL and then FIL after 3 years and annualy thereafter as long as income/assets reduces annually.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the replies,which are appreciated.
My wife is handling the arrangements,which as you can imagine,suddenly were plonked down in front of her.
I think our first port of call should be a reassessment for my MIL,as her savings will doubtless have fallen in the 5 year interim.
Additionally,as my MIL is an adult dependent on FIL's OAP benefit,is this a relevant facet of the HSE assessment ?
There is also much discussion as to renting out the In-Laws house to defray costs,however I remain wary of this on a number of grounds,not least of which would be the Revenue situation?
All suggestions/comments welcome :)
 
Gerdoy said:
Additionally,as my MIL is an adult dependent on FIL's OAP benefit,is this a relevant facet of the HSE assessment ?
There is also much discussion as to renting out the In-Laws house to defray costs,however I remain wary of this on a number of grounds,not least of which would be the Revenue situation?
All suggestions/comments welcome :)
Click to expand...

Your MIL might well get a lesser amount as your FIL’s dependant but under Fair Deal as a couple that’s irrelevant, each applicant will be assessed on half their joint income.

Putting aside the revenue situation, and all the issues that come with being a landlord, under Fair Deal all income, including rental income is assessed indefinitely, so 80% would go towards their contribution, hardly worth the headache.

I have relations in under Fair Deal who have long term vacant houses for this reason, in my own estate there are a few with overgrown gardens etc, they are referred to as the ‘’Fair Deal Houses’’
 
Incredible really,that at a time of housing "crisis" a potential source of habitable properties is kept off the pitch ?
I am conscious of the risks inherent in becoming an "amateur landlord",which I personally,would not be too keen to take on.
However,with the ever mounting costs associated with Nursing Home admission,the situation needs to be addressed fairly rapidly.
Back to the HSE for more information.
 
Just a quick update with a bit of "good" news,thanks to twofor1 and slim's posts,we had a reassessment done on MIL's situation which resulted in quite a reduction in her weekly payment.Thanks for the heads-up everybody :)
 
Updating the situation re this thread.
Sadly my Father in Law passed away after less than 6 months in the Nursing Home.
This leaves his Wife (Full Alzheimers) as his sole beneficiary,with no instructions regarding a plan B in the event of incapacity etc.
However,as an extended family,we now have to address yet another "New" situation.

Following his death,all his bank accounts are now frozen,including the (single-name) account from which the non Fair Deal element of BOTH Father in Law AND Mother in Law are paid.

The executor of the will is the Solicitor who drew the document up.

As MiL is resident in the Nursing Home for 6 years now,and has had a recent reassessment which reduced her contribution,I am concerned that as the Bank Accounts are frozen we may be looking at a situation whereby although sufficient funds ARE available to pay the Direct Debit,these may not be paid until a Ward of Court procedure is enacted for my incapicated MiL.

The Solicitor/Executor appears quite vague on how this somewhat pressing need is to be addressed,but instead reminds us that a WoC application may take 4 months to process.
My question (one of many) is whether my Wife,as next of kin to her mother,has any ability to access funds in her mothers accounts,even on an interim emergency basis,to secure the ongoing Nursing Home care ?
 
Hello all.
When my FIL passed away,he left everything to his wilf,my MIL.
Since my MIL,now totally incapicated with Alzheimers,and entering her 6th year in the Nursing Home Fair Deal scheme,is the sole beneficiary of her husbands will,does she now have a change of circulstances which require reassessment of her FDS position ?
As she is currently the subject of a Ward Of Court application by two of her daughters,and therefore,not actually in control of the additional cash funds and full ownership of her home since her husbands death,what is the best approach to take regarding her ongoing FDS entitlement ?
Taken literally,her husband left her approx 80€K in the Bank,however the situation regarding the home ownership is also causing some concern,as we do not know what,if any,effect this will now have,given her long term residency of the Nursing Home.

Any suggestions or experiences which might help ?
 
I think your FIL’s passing is a notifiable change in circumstances which might require reassessment.

If my circumstances change? You must advise the HSE within 10 working days if you or your partner’s circumstances change, as your financial support may be affected e.g. if your spouse/partner dies or you or your spouse/partner sell your property………………………………..

Page 1 here;

http://www.hse.ie/eng/services/list/4/olderpeople/nhss/AppForm.pdf

As your MIL is in care for nearly 6 years and the family home was disregarded after 3 years, I would hope there is no additional liability as your MIL now owns 100% of the house.

On the savings only a €36K disregard might now apply rather than the €72K for a couple.

Maybe give the HSE infoline 1850 24 1850 or your local nursing home support office, a call to confirm.
 
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