EBS: Is there ever a chance that they will demutualise?

Is there ever a chance that these fellas would demutualise ?

[tomthevet]

Hopefully - they are constantly wasting money telling us how lucky we are to be a mutual - reminds me of standard life - proud to be a mutual etc

[RainyDay]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Is there ever a chance that these fellas would demutualise ?

Only if some EBS members submit a motion to the AGM to make this happen and the motion gets passed.

[GreatDane]

Entirely correct Rainyday :thumbs:

The day approaches, based upon continued poor service to the real mutual members who are now faced with subsidising cheap property investment property loans amongst other things, me thinks

Cheers

G>

[ClubMan]

So I presume this means that you (and maybe NOelC) are finally going to start that DM campaign?

[GreatDane]

Originally Posted by ClubMan

So I presume this means that you (and maybe NOelC) are finally going to start that DM campaign?

I wonder what might ever make you think this Clubman ?

From speaking to various other EBS members, it seems there are more & more unhappy members starting to express their feelings with the way the society is being run every day now.

It's only a matter of time before someone (this may or may not include either NoelC, myself, or both ) decides to call on the society to demutualise ... or at least, get sufficient support to ensure a vote is held on the matter.

Cheers

G>

[ClubMan]

Originally Posted by Garrettod

It's only a matter of time before someone (this may or may not include either NoelC, myself, or both ) decides to call on the society to demutualise ... or at least, get sufficient support to ensure a vote is held on the matter.

Yes, time. And effort. Naturally tabling a motion on something like DM is within the remit of any member of the society. However, I haven't yet seen any sign that any of the allegedly increasing numbers of disgruntled EBS members are taking any constructive action (as opposed to just talking/moaning about it and seemingly waiting for somebody else to put in the hard graft) to get the DM ball rolling so if I was the original poster I wouldn't necessarily hold my breath. On the other hand if I am mistaken and you know directly or indirectly about any such campaign I am open to correction.

Just for the record I have recently become a member of the society once again (this time as as saver rather than a borrower) and do agree that the society has some issues that could do with addressing. For example: daily rather than monthly calculation of interest, current account mortgages, more competitive tracker rates instead of the technically correct but ultimately irrelevant claim to have the lowest standard variable rate etc. For my part, rather than just sitting around moaning about these and other issues, I have contacted the society voicing my views and will continue to do so in an attempt to have them highlighted and addressed. Right now I am of the opinion that such issues could be better dealt in ways other than DM and given the option today would vote against DM.

Do you think that once Irish Nationwide and Standard Life pay out, that Irish people will say "enough is enough" and put pressure on the EBS to demutualise ?

[RainyDay]

Originally Posted by Unregistered

Do you think that once Irish Nationwide and Standard Life pay out, that Irish people will say "enough is enough" and put pressure on the EBS to demutualise ?

The problem is (as outlined above) that regardless of how much people moan, until someone is prepared to get up off their backside and do the work necessary to collect 25 signatures and get a motion down for the AGM, nothing will happen.

But didn't Standard Life as well as Friends Provident demutualise without a member revolt ?

[RainyDay]

Don't know anything about Friends Provident, but the 'baggers were revolting at Standing Life for many years.

[tomthevet]

Originally Posted by RainyDay

Don't know anything about Friends Provident, but the 'baggers were revolting at Standing Life for many years.

Yes but it was in the end the companys decision - there was a second attempt under way by David Stonebanks but the it was the company who eventually put it on the agenda - after a vist from the regulators

Roll on the same thing happening at EBS.


How much of a windfall would we be in for in any case ?

[ClubMan]

Probably not as much as other Irish DMs since, as I understand it, EBS don't maintain the same level of surplus as other mutual operations did in the past as a matter of course. I'm not sure what you analyse (e.g. in the annual reports/accounts) to estimate the potential DM windfall that might arise. I heard the figure of c. €800 mentioned in the past but I don't know where that came from or how accurate it might have been or be now.

Just curious to know if any of the contributors here who are in favour of an EBS DM have actually taken any specific, concrete actions with a view to achieving their aim - for example:

• studying the society rules and the relevant legislation (e.g. Friendly Societies Act) to see what they need to do in order to get the ball rolling
• considering running for election to the board
• organising/convening a DM campaign group which will most likely require a funding effort and a lot of voluntary work
• drafting a DM motion for submission to the next AGM or calling an EGM for this purpose
• canvassing for support among the society members for a DM campaign and setting out the case for this rather than the status quo or some form of reform etc.
• etc...

Or are they all waiting for somebody else to do something? Because if nobody is actively working towards this end then the likelyhood of a DM is totally down to a decision by the board and they are still totally committed to mutuality so it's not likely to happen any time soon as things stand.

Fair point: if you're not prepared to become actively involved in DM, then you should shut up.

Its a bit like all these people who never stand for TD or President, and yet somehow think they have the right to do things like vote, or criticise politicians. Why don't ye let your betters just get on with running things as they are, and stop getting ideas above yer station ???

[ClubMan]

I presume you're being sarcastic or facetious but that is not exactly what I said. People are of course free to express their opinions on this or any other matter here but others are free to question or rebut them. I was just curious about why people who seem to get so exercised or excited about this specific matter (potential DM of the EBS) don't seem to do anything constructive to achieve their goals but just seem to talk about it as if it might happen by default some day if they wait around for it?

[Duke of Marmalade]

Once this law is passed which says a BS can DM and immediately sell, the pressure on EBS to do so will be intense.

There are so many parties who have so much to gain. The members with their windfall. The management with their share options and big salary hikes. The predators wanting to get more of the Celtic Tiger action. A little bit of paperwork is not going to stand in the way of this Tsunami of greed. Sign up quickly, I say.

How do I become a member ?

What is the windfall likely to be ?

[ClubMan]

Take out a mortgage or open a share/investment savings account with at least €127 (?) in order to become a member of the society. Being a member is the first step towards qualifying for any windfall should the society ever decide to DM. Other rules will probably also apply in such circumstances (e.g. size of mortgage outstanding, length of time you have been a member etc.). Your second question was addressed earlier insofar as this is possible at all at the moment.

Sounds like Harchibald is right then. We should sign up quickly.