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  #1  
Old 24-11-2011, 10:25 AM
Purple Purple is offline
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Default More Anti-Israeli protests, this time about a film festival!

The Irish Times has a piece about this disturbing attempt by anti-Isaeli activists trying to limit freedom of expression. It seems that even left-wing Israelis are not allowed to air their views here now.
By the way, does anyone know where there's a list of "artists" who are boycotting Isreali events so that I can boycott them?

I presume these same activists boycott Syrian and Iranian cultural events (since they claim to be concerned about the people in the West Bank and Gaza, the displaced Syrians and Egyptians that are now called Palestinians).
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  #2  
Old 24-11-2011, 11:45 AM
DrMoriarty DrMoriarty is offline
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انكم جميعا يموت ويذهب الى الجحيم
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  #3  
Old 24-11-2011, 12:20 PM
oldnick oldnick is offline
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I have this weird theory about Irish lib-left circles ,as well as in much of Europe, it works like this :-

If a state is basically white/European/Western and it is oppressing non-whites then it is evil and must be shunned and even attacked.

If a state is non-white and it is oppressing non-whites then ,well it's not O.K., but we're not going to shun or attack it. Or at least most of us won't -we're too busy attacking israel.

Israel is a "white" state. Not technically correct -but the perception is that it's basically a European entity settled in amongst a non-European area. (Actually, half its Jewish population are Mizrachi -i.e. mainly from Arab/Asian countries who look no different from Palestinians-plus there's a sprinkling of black ,usually Falasha, Jews and even an Indian community of Jews-Bnai Israel).
Israel is also a state fanatically supported by the USA- which makes it extra bad.

Israel can act in a stupid arrogant manner, especially under the present extreme right-wing government with thugs like Lieberman in its cabinet. The support for the expansionist, often brutish, religious nutcase settlers is disconcerting to those of us who admire the great achievements of Israel. The daily humiliation of ordinary Palestinain men,women and children at check-points, the grabbing of their land -and so on and so on...... all very bad and it's O.K. to protest against these things.

But why barely a whimper from the same protesters against the monstrous activties of so many other regimes -whether its Iran,Libya (until recently), Syria. Why are there tens of thousands oF Western Saharis in refugee camps in ALgeria whilst Morocco occupies their land ?
The Arab Khartoum regime for thirty years killed hundreds of thousands of black Southern Sudanese-where were the protests? Why such refusal amongst the Moslems states occupying Kurdistan to deny independence to the Kurds.? Only ,with Usa, help did the Iraqi part of Kurdistan achieve some form of autonomy- No chance in Turkey or Iran. (In Turkey, Kurdish MPs, along with thousands of Kurdish demonstrators, are imprisoned whilst Turkey is upholding the democratic rights of the Syrians and Palestinians!)

It's not just Arabs or Moslems persecuting their own people or their own ethnic minorities. Many African and Asian states do the same. But nary a word of protest from the anti-Israeli lobby.

Now the anti-Israeil lobby is going further -not just content with protests they are now boycotting and forcing others to do so -whilst tens of thousands languish in African and Asian jails because of their writings, speeches, actions or views (- if they havent already been tortured or killed).
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  #4  
Old 24-11-2011, 12:56 PM
Purple Purple is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrMoriarty View Post
انكم جميعا يموت ويذهب الى الجحيم
Why will I do to hell when I die?
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  #5  
Old 24-11-2011, 01:12 PM
Latrade Latrade is offline
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As a slight aside, I remember one particuarly anti-Israel friend who would use the animated documentary Waltz with Bashir as proof of how disgusting Israel was and how they sought to cover up their crimes.

He's right of course, there was silence and it was a crime. But it was a film made by an Israeli and received well in Israel too and in Hollywood. Not really the actions or thoughts of a race out to wipe Palestine out of existence.

And it's funny that once he did discover it was produced by an Israeli, he stopped promoting how great it was and instead chose to focus on its flaws.
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  #6  
Old 24-11-2011, 01:56 PM
ccbkd ccbkd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldnick View Post
I have this weird theory about Irish lib-left circles ,as well as in much of Europe, it works like this :-

If a state is basically white/European/Western and it is oppressing non-whites then it is evil and must be shunned and even attacked.

If a state is non-white and it is oppressing non-whites then ,well it's not O.K., but we're not going to shun or attack it. Or at least most of us won't -we're too busy attacking israel.

Israel is a "white" state. Not technically correct -but the perception is that it's basically a European entity settled in amongst a non-European area. (Actually, half its Jewish population are Mizrachi -i.e. mainly from Arab/Asian countries who look no different from Palestinians-plus there's a sprinkling of black ,usually Falasha, Jews and even an Indian community of Jews-Bnai Israel).
Israel is also a state fanatically supported by the USA- which makes it extra bad.

Israel can act in a stupid arrogant manner, especially under the present extreme right-wing government with thugs like Lieberman in its cabinet. The support for the expansionist, often brutish, religious nutcase settlers is disconcerting to those of us who admire the great achievements of Israel. The daily humiliation of ordinary Palestinain men,women and children at check-points, the grabbing of their land -and so on and so on...... all very bad and it's O.K. to protest against these things.

But why barely a whimper from the same protesters against the monstrous activties of so many other regimes -whether its Iran,Libya (until recently), Syria. Why are there tens of thousands oF Western Saharis in refugee camps in ALgeria whilst Morocco occupies their land ?
The Arab Khartoum regime for thirty years killed hundreds of thousands of black Southern Sudanese-where were the protests? Why such refusal amongst the Moslems states occupying Kurdistan to deny independence to the Kurds.? Only ,with Usa, help did the Iraqi part of Kurdistan achieve some form of autonomy- No chance in Turkey or Iran. (In Turkey, Kurdish MPs, along with thousands of Kurdish demonstrators, are imprisoned whilst Turkey is upholding the democratic rights of the Syrians and Palestinians!)

It's not just Arabs or Moslems persecuting their own people or their own ethnic minorities. Many African and Asian states do the same. But nary a word of protest from the anti-Israeli lobby.

Now the anti-Israeil lobby is going further -not just content with protests they are now boycotting and forcing others to do so -whilst tens of thousands languish in African and Asian jails because of their writings, speeches, actions or views (- if they havent already been tortured or killed).
Two wrongs do not make a right.
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  #7  
Old 24-11-2011, 02:40 PM
horusd horusd is offline
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Actually I see no problem in boycotting Israeli cultural events. Israeli ambassadors were summoned last yr to better promote Israel and help it explain its position in the world, cultural events suggest a normal relationship with a state, and there is nothing normal about the state of Israel, or our relationship to it. Passports and theft immediately spring to mind.

A protest is to register disapproval of the state and isn't an infringement on its liberty per se. Much less an infringement than Israel imposes on the Pals by a country mile. As a by the by I went to an Israeli made film two years ago and was met be pro-Israeli supporters protesting it .
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  #8  
Old 24-11-2011, 05:48 PM
oldnick oldnick is offline
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"two wrongs do not make a right"

-absolutely correct.

And continually concentrating on one wrong whilst always ignoring other often far worse wrongs is ,well, wrong.
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  #9  
Old 25-11-2011, 05:11 PM
horusd horusd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrMoriarty View Post
انكم جميعا يموت ويذهب الى الجحيم
Isn't Arabic a lovely script? What does this mean btw?
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  #10  
Old 26-11-2011, 01:43 PM
Superman Superman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by horusd View Post
Isn't Arabic a lovely script? What does this mean btw?
You will go to hell when you die.
(google translate)
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  #11  
Old 27-11-2011, 10:42 AM
horusd horusd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Superman View Post
You will go to hell when you die.
(google translate)
Cheerful!
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  #12  
Old 27-11-2011, 11:42 AM
Purple Purple is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrMoriarty View Post
انكم جميعا يموت ويذهب الى الجحيم
Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple View Post
Why will I do to hell when I die?
Quote:
Originally Posted by horusd View Post
Isn't Arabic a lovely script? What does this mean btw?
Am I on your ignore list as well?!
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  #13  
Old 27-11-2011, 12:50 PM
DrMoriarty DrMoriarty is offline
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Are you on the Devil's ignore list, Purple?

How come my Google translation comes out as "אתה כל ימות ללכת לעזאזל"?
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  #14  
Old 27-11-2011, 02:46 PM
horusd horusd is offline
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Sorry Purple ... didn't see your translation...!
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  #15  
Old 28-11-2011, 11:03 AM
onq onq is offline
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I don't agree with boycotting cultural events per se.

In the present case, people of Jewish descent are some of the most creative and expressive in the world.
The problem is that there are several different sides to any nation, and being good at picture making doesn't negate Israel's record on human rights abuses.

I think that after the illegal detention of foreign nationals in international waters who were attempting to bring aid to Gaza was wrong and people may therefore be voicing a protest.
I don't think this is the right way to do it - I'd prefer to see a flotilla of unarmed ships approaching Gaza to offer aid, following an UN resolution to let them through.

But if America once again uses its veto I think the veto should be ignored and the flotilla should set sail anyway.
Then we'll see the extent of Israel's dislocation from its humanity.
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  #16  
Old 28-11-2011, 11:49 AM
oldnick oldnick is offline
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By concentrating on Israel's record on human rights abuses we can more easily ignore those of surrounding nations.
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  #17  
Old 28-11-2011, 02:02 PM
horusd horusd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldnick View Post
By concentrating on Israel's record on human rights abuses we can more easily ignore those of surrounding nations.
Yes nick but the Israeli's have the temerity to suggest that they are a normal democratic nation based on respect for human rights. They make no allusion to the theocratic nature of their state, or their illegal acquisitions of other people's lands, nor their iron fist approach to ensuring their own safety and dominance.

Paradoxically, for Israeli's who want to see their state continue and live in peace, their government's continuing repression of the Pals only acts to undermine the legitimacy of the entire state.
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  #18  
Old 28-11-2011, 02:23 PM
oldnick oldnick is offline
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Yes I agree with that. Israel's worst enemy is itself with its never -ending counter -productive measures. For truly democratic fair minded Israelis the actions of their government must be so frustrating. And I do think it is reasonable to demonstrate against the Israeli govnts actions.

What I find frustrating,unreasonable and to some extent incomprehensible is that there never (or almost never) any demonstrations, protest,boycotss against any of the actions of the surrounding nations or indeed of almost any African or Moslem nation.

It is the sheer one-sided attitude (not any protests per se which I would tend to agree with) that I can't fathom -especially coming from people who claim to support human rights, freedom and fairness.
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  #19  
Old 28-11-2011, 02:43 PM
Bill Struth Bill Struth is offline
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Poor little Israel continues with it's collective punishment of an entire peoples.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...uthority-wages

If boycotts were good enough for Apartheid, then they're certainly good enough for the racist state that is Israel.
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  #20  
Old 28-11-2011, 08:42 PM
oldnick oldnick is offline
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According to Chanel 4's "Unreported World" and as per many sites one can google -e.g wikepedia has an article on illegal african refugees in israel ...

..there are thousands of Africans-mainly Eritreans and Sudanese -who trek thousands of miles to a place of safe refuge were they won't starve,get robbed and killed, and they choose Israel.

The UN High Commissioner for Refugees declared that they should not be expelled from Israel to their country of origin nor even to Egypt whence they last came ,as Egypt would probably return them.

So the UNHCR evidently thinks its better for these Africans to stay in the racist state of Israel than return to their own African countries !

(Incidentally,Mr Mugabe is very grateful for the attention paid to South Africa in the 1980s,especially by the Irish whilst he started destroying his country and massacring thousands of his fellow Africans, mainly Matabele -just as Assad Sr. in the same decade killed 20.000 fellow-Syrians in Homs.Maybe it was only 10.000.Who cares? The Israelis weren't involved so it doesnt matter) )
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