what a cheek by Alan Shatter- use your own money.

Purple if you have got nothing better to post except a throwaway comment did you should not post. And as for the +1.....

Please explain why its disgraceful ie back it up with some sensible comments, viz say he does not know the J&J people, which is not true,

He did not donate the money to charity he gave it to a friend. He was only enititled to it because another minister did not sign off the paper in time.

The " HONOURABLE" thing would have been to face up and say " As I have already voted against such perks it would be incorrect for me to accept this payment, therefore I have declined it." I can assure you he would gain far more kudos and maybe won back a bit of decency for the dail. What he has done is cock a snoop at the lot of us.

I have donated to J&J and I can assure you I will not be donating again and I have told them so.
 
Your objection to the donation is based on the premise that the money wasn't his. Awkward and unpleasant as it was, it was in fairness his own money - he had a right to bestow it where he wished or to refuse it. Clearly he wanted to make a point of protest by taking the money but does not wish to benefit from it personally so he donates it (with attendent brouhaha solely for the embarrassment of his party).

Your only objection to the organisation is that he knows the people who run it. He did not give the money to them, he gave it to JnJ, they may be the ones who direct how it will be spent but they will be constrained to spend it on behalf of the organisation same as any other donation made to them. As to the fact that they are friends, why is that surprising or something to object to? Would it make the donation any more valuable or laudable if he gave it to an organisation where he knew no-one? (In a country this size, that might even be hard for a longstanding politician)

The person he was cocking-a-snook at was Enda Kenny for pushing him out. No-one else need bother be offended.
 
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Vanilla said:
Well said.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't in this country, at least Shatter gives a damn enough to try.
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Lots of people give lots of money to charity every day. Why do you think Shatter let the story drag out for days before making an announcement that he will be giving the money to a charity that has been extremly vocal in its criticism of the Government and the handling of medical cards? He could have issued a brief press release about what he was doing at the very beginning but he decides to wait until the day before the elections. He used the money and the charity to score political revenge on Enda Kenny.

A very worthy charity got a sizeable donation but that's the only good that came out of this story. Shatter certainly doesn't come out of well which takes some doing after making a charitable donation of that size.
 
NOAH said:
He did not donate the money to charity he gave it to a friend. He was only enititled to it because another minister did not sign off the paper in time.
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He gave it to a friend to spend on nursing care for children with cancer.

It will do far more good with J&J than it would in the black hole that is the public finance.
 
Sunny said:
A very worthy charity got a sizeable donation but that's the only good that came out of this story. Shatter certainly doesn't come out of well which takes some doing after making a charitable donation of that size.
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Shatter is hounded for an answer as to whether he is taking the money personally or not. He gives a statement that he is donating it to charity. So he is wrong to give the statement, wrong to 'take' the money, wrong to associate the charity with it, possibly getting a tax benefit out of it, and deliberately embarrassing the government. As I said, damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.
 
NOAH said:
Purple if you have got nothing better to post except a throwaway comment did you should not post. And as for the +1.....

Please explain why its disgraceful ie back it up with some sensible comments, viz say he does not know the J&J people, which is not true,

He did not donate the money to charity he gave it to a friend. He was only enititled to it because another minister did not sign off the paper in time.

The " HONOURABLE" thing would have been to face up and say " As I have already voted against such perks it would be incorrect for me to accept this payment, therefore I have declined it." I can assure you he would gain far more kudos and maybe won back a bit of decency for the dail. What he has done is cock a snoop at the lot of us.

I have donated to J&J and I can assure you I will not be donating again and I have told them so.
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He did not give it to a friend. He gave it to a charity run by friends. Your attack on the character of the people running the Jack and Jill Foundation is what's disgraceful and you should withdraw it and apologise.
I don't really care about the political manoeuvring around the donation. It would take far more than Mr. Shatter declining his payment to restore my faith in politics. What I do know it like him or not we've lost the best legislator in the Dail and given our utter inability to enact watertight legislation that's not a good thing.
 
The whole thing stinks.

If Alan Shatter wanted to do the honourable thing he shouldn't have made a political issue of it. By all means donate it but don't make a big spectacle of it.
 
Vanilla said:
Shatter is hounded for an answer as to whether he is taking the money personally or not. He gives a statement that he is donating it to charity. So he is wrong to give the statement, wrong to 'take' the money, wrong to associate the charity with it, possibly getting a tax benefit out of it, and deliberately embarrassing the government. As I said, damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.
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How would he have been damned if he didn't take the money? He chose to take the money as he was entitled to and I have already said I have no problem with that. I do have a problem with him using the whole thing as a political stunt. Did it really need a press conference in the steps of the Dail? Seriously.
 
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/c...rogant-alan-shatters-last-stand-30302259.html
Gene Kerrigan's take on Alan's grand gesture
Government policies are damaging people who already face dreadful challenges. Which is why Alan Shatter's little pantomime in front of Leinster House on Thursday was grotesque...This Government is inflicting hell on sick people and their families. Parents of children with leukaemia are given to understand that it's in the best interests of the country that they lose their medical card and all that goes with it. The Government forces people who face immense stress to take time out of their troubled lives to explain, to argue, to plead.
Such treatment of anyone is wrong. To do it to people who are already stressed from dealing with serious illness – whether their own or the illness of a loved one – is cruel. Mr Shatter's little media game filled a need in his life, but it cut too close to a sick reality created by the Government in which he was proud to serve.
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NOAH said:
Purple if you have got nothing better to post except a throwaway comment did you should not post. And as for the +1.....

Please explain why its disgraceful ie back it up with some sensible comments, viz say he does not know the J&J people, which is not true,

He did not donate the money to charity he gave it to a friend.
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I didn't think it needed explaining but obviously you still don't get it NOAH. It is disgraceful to question the integrity of the J&J charity as a result of their receiving this money. It is disgraceful to imply that this is somehow money going from one friend to another, not a donation to a worthy cause. You should be ashamed of your comments and withdraw them but that appears beyond you.
 
Sunny said:
How would he have been damned if he didn't take the money? He chose to take the money as he was entitled to and I have already said I have no problem with that. I do have a problem with him using the whole thing as a political stunt. Did it really need a press conference in the steps of the Dail? Seriously.
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Yea, I have to agree with that.
 
NOAH said:
The " HONOURABLE" thing would have been to face up and say " As I have already voted against such perks it would be incorrect for me to accept this payment, therefore I have declined it." I can assure you he would gain far more kudos and maybe won back a bit of decency for the dail. What he has done is cock a snoop at the lot of us.

.
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I agree with the above. And I also agree that Jack & Jill could be seen to be tainted by this, but they can not afford to say no. I think the manner of Shatter giving it to them and insisting they be on the plinth outside the Dail is disgraceful. I have all the time in the world for Jonathan Irwin. His charity does great work, and he shouldn't have to rely on charity to do the wonderful work of his charity. I think you're being unfair to them by ignoring that. I'm sure it pained them to have to take the money in such a manner.
 
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