irish water

Attica

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Just curious - when the Govt of the day sets about privatising Irish Water Ltd., how will AAM contributors view that?

As a good thing, because now prices may fall and privatisation always brings reduced prices?

As a bad thing, because a country's water shouldn't belong to any group of people no matter how rich they are, in detriment to those who will not be able to pay?
 
Just curious - when the Govt of the day sets about privatising Irish Water Ltd., how will AAM contributors view that?

As a good thing, because now prices may fall and privatisation always brings reduced prices?

As a bad thing, because a country's water shouldn't belong to any group of people no matter how rich they are, in detriment to those who will not be able to pay?

Electricity supply has been opened up, with the infrastructure still owned by the State.

Same with telephones - remember Telecom Eireann?!

There's no reason why water supply should be any different in the long term, electricity is pretty much as essential as water these days - if the country had no electricity for a week more people would probably die, than if there was no running water for a week.

No matter who the operator is it will always be a regulated market.
 
There's a protest this coming Saturday at 2pm if anyone's interested in attending - not sure who Right2Water are and not sure if what they are saying on this website is correct.

Irish Water has sent you an ‘application pack’ and they want you to fill in details about your household, including your PPS number. Don't engage. People power can beat them.

There are two purposes to these packs:

1) It is an information gathering exercise so they can charge you for using water.

2) They want you to accept water charges. You will be asked to declare that you are a customer of Irish Water. In other words, to give up your right as a citizen to water – and start paying.

The average per household charge will be €278 a year. But the charges will rise after that. One former ESRI economist from has estimated that it will eventually be €600 a year.

We can stop these charges if we come together and resist. In the 1990s, the government tried to impose water charges on domestic users. They were met with mass protests and were forced to retreat. People power defeated the water charges then. We can do the same today.

We would urge you, therefore, not to fill in the form. You could send it back to Irish Water unopened or place it in your bin or simply ignore it. At the very least, hold off signing for the moment to see if a major campaign gets going.

Don’t let Irish Water or the government scare or bully you.

* You cannot be jailed or fined for refusing to co-operate with Irish Water.

* They cannot automatically take the water charge out of your wage packet or your social welfare because it is not a tax that the Revenue Commissioners control.

Resistance to Irish Water has taken in hold in many estates that have been protesting.
 
once again Irish Water charges are set as a vicious regressive tax. Irish people already pay for their water and distribution network via general taxation. Even a die hard neo-con can easily see the entire configuration of Irish Water is a mess and utterly over staffed and over priced.If more money is required for water let it collected via fair and equitable progressive taxation. FG and labour will lose the next election over this stealth tax alone never mind all of the recent nauseous revelations about how they govern!
 
once again Irish Water charges are set as a vicious regressive tax. Irish people already pay for their water and distribution network via general taxation. Even a die hard neo-con can easily see the entire configuration of Irish Water is a mess and utterly over staffed and over priced.If more money is required for water let it collected via fair and equitable progressive taxation. FG and labour will lose the next election over this stealth tax alone never mind all of the recent nauseous revelations about how they govern!

What a load of populist nonsense.

Water is a utility, and paying for it is not a tax, any more than paying for your electricity, phone or gas.

Or do you want "the rich" to pay for electricity, gas and TV for the rest of the population as well..?

Try living Uzbekistan or North Korea if you want free water, and see how those Utopian societies float your boat.

Oh, and if memory serves me correctly, you weren't paying the LPT - how's that worked out for you?
 
FG and labour will lose the next election over this stealth tax alone never mind all of the recent nauseous revelations about how they govern!

Do you really think anyone who will likely replace them will repeal this legislation?
 
What actually seems really weird is the idea that a resource which costs money to produce should be totally free at point of delivery with no rationing at all by the price mechanism.

This is completely separate from the question as to whether certain sections of society should have their water supply subsidised.

As to whether private companies are more efficient than public companies, they do seem to have one big advantage in that they are not held to ransom by the unions.

Mind you, IW seem to be making a complete haims of it.
 
When people start receiving high water bills Irish Water will no doubt want to show us how we can save money by purchasing water efficient products which their agents can install.

No doubt the Irish Government will want to encourage people to conserve this most precious resource by incentivising the cost of such upgrades? On second thoughts perhaps not.
 
probably be a huge vote winner for any party that promises to do so..

I can't see any party promising that. If you think that party might be Sinn Fein, then just look at their track record of increased taxation and reduced social welfare in the north.
 
What a load of populist nonsense.

Water is a utility, and paying for it is not a tax, any more than paying for your electricity, phone or gas.

Or do you want "the rich" to pay for electricity, gas and TV for the rest of the population as well..?

Try living Uzbekistan or North Korea if you want free water, and see how those Utopian societies float your boat.

Oh, and if memory serves me correctly, you weren't paying the LPT - how's that worked out for you?

+1

Some of the rubbish being spouted by the anti-water charges brigade is just aggravating.

It is fundamentally wrong that we have up until now hidden from the cost of provision of water services in this country. It costs to collect, make potable and distribute clean drinking water. It is also costs to collect and treat waste. We are utterly out of line in not charging for the services and as for the cost of water services, [broken link removed] The proposed charge is not excessive when compared to other jurisdictions.
 
can we apply for a rebate from revenue for the amount we pay irish water each year?
otherwise its seems we are paying for it twice!
 
I've heard that IW won't have it charge VAT which is fair enough. If this is the case then I presume VAT will be removed for bottled water, to ensure some form of fairness?
 
I've heard that IW won't have it charge VAT which is fair enough. If this is the case then I presume VAT will be removed for bottled water, to ensure some form of fairness?
Makes me think, should there not be several water products. Think of the water we use in flushing the loo and in car washes. Unthinkable that this would be bottled water.

I suppose it must not be economic to treat the water to varying standards, though it seems very strange that now that we are paying for it loo water will be as expensive as drinking water.
 
I've heard that IW won't have it charge VAT which is fair enough. If this is the case then I presume VAT will be removed for bottled water, to ensure some form of fairness?

How so? One is a utility, the other a relative luxury item.
 
Makes me think, should there not be several water products. Think of the water we use in flushing the loo and in car washes. Unthinkable that this would be bottled water.

I suppose it must not be economic to treat the water to varying standards, though it seems very strange that now that we are paying for it loo water will be as expensive as drinking water.

We were all (well, net contributors to the tax take at least) paying anyway. Just now it's moving to a pay as you use model.

Building regs will start to require rainwater harvesting for all new builds, it'd be extortionately expensive to retro-fit multiple water supply networks.
 
Rainwater harvesting and grey water collection, both for toilet flushing, is definitely the way to go.

Multiple water delivery sounds totally unpractical - considering they cant properly manage the leaks on the original system.

I wonder how many of the "we're paying for it already" crowd actually pay tax?? There's a certain character abounding in Irish society that clogs up our hospitals on a Saturday night, is "known to Gardai", and has never contributed anything to society - yet we pay them for the privilege of having then live among us. I'm very in favour of linking everything up, a la the LPT, so we dont have to put up with people giving the State the two figures while taking its cash - like fines and hospital charges (drunk idiot stuff) coming off dole. Once there are consequences then behaviour changes, until then....

And all this whining about the PPS numbers, if you dont want the allowance dont give your number....simples. When I take power in the 'Attila the Hun was a Pinko Leftie' party I'd introduce an information tax credit, you give us all this info (for proper government planning, removal of duplication across departments etc.) and we give you a significant tax credit. If you want to be paranoid and not give it then fine, your choice, pay me more tax for forcing me to operate inefficiently.

Rant over, ...feeling very right wing today.
 
Apparently, in some countries with water charges it is illegal to harvest rain water! It was interfering with the profits of private water companies.

Could you imagine the scenes if that was tried here!
 
Apparently, in some countries with water charges it is illegal to harvest rain water! It was interfering with the profits of private water companies.

Could you imagine the scenes if that was tried here!

In fairness that would give the lie to the view that its all about conservation. Which it partly is (I think, or at least it should be), the other part being about recouping cost.

As regards IW & how it is being introduced, have they really made that bad a job of it???, of course its madness the level of staffing they have and the overall cost of the 'project' - but in terms of what they have done on the ground and how they have communicated, I wouldnt have thought it is that disastrous or that someone else might have done it oh so much better??? (Note, IMHO I think the PPS thing is a bit overhyped, and isnt it fair to say that with any dealing with the government you need to use your PPSN, so why take it out on IW that they have to ask for it??).
 
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