Are Budapest developers still ripping foreigners off?

According to Transparency International, the main world body in terms of corruption analysis, Hungary is 41st on the list out of 160 countries and is ahead of Czech Republic, Lithuania, Latvia, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Romania, Croatia and twenty places ahead of Poland, its biggest competitor in terms of FDI.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Corruption_Perceptions_Index

By no means is it perfect, but it is actually improving, not getting worse. I don't think the US ambassador's comments are correct in this instance.
 
Interesting that Ireland is very close in points to the US......does this make Bertie on a par with Bush ? The Teflon seems to be wearing a bit thin of late!!
 
Hello all, I have just joined your message board. This forum is full of very interesting & informative posts for anyone wanting to know the 'full story' of investing in Hungary. I have discovered in the past that it is sometimes better to walk away rather than risk one's capital in a non transparent market.
A lot of good things come out of Hungary with regard to the arts. In fact I shall be visiting later this month for the first time and heading straight to the ballet at the opera house.
You might be asking why I have made this posting and the reason is to try and complete a little more research on 'value for money' developers. My sole pension pot is at risk here so I do not fancy paying 20% over market value. If I cannot pay the 'hungarian price' then I shall walk away.
The selling literature of some of these international agents seems a bit misleading. Hollingworth state that their Ibiza Gardens price per sq mtr of €2000 is half of what the marina development in district 13 was sold for. Upon looking it appears to be €100 more.
I would welcome any recommendations on off plan developments in Budapest' with at least 12 months to go before completion being offered by Hungarian agents. It could be that I may need a cheap property finder, rather than relying on my own judgement. I shall be 'in' for the long term.
Its a shame that the UK state pension is so low that many of us in the UK have to leave at retirement age just to be able to make ends meet in a foreign country with a lower cost of living.
Thanks in advance for any tips.
balmpots
 
balmpots said:
Hollingworth state that their Ibiza Gardens price per sq mtr of €2000 half of what the marina development in district 13 was sold for.
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As you say, this is totally inaccurate. There is still good availability in Marina Part from around €1,870/sqm.

Why are you interested in off-plan only? I wouldn't really recommend it in Budapest. Several of the recent major (mainly Autoker) projects in the city seem to have had quite serious quality problems in terms of finish, including Marina Part, Gozsdu Udvar, Sun Palace among others. Szinyei Merse Ház was over-built and the developers (Autoker again) has had legal problems in relation to getting an occupancy permit.
 
budapest said:
Several of the recent major (mainly Autoker) projects in the city seem to have had quite serious quality problems in terms of finish, including Marina Part, Gozsdu Udvar, Sun Palace among others.
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Autoker has also a communication branch, Comunique.
I don't have any complaints about the internet, but the quality of their phonelines is very 'I can't hear you because I call from a submarine'-style.
(actually it's always a miracle if you can make a call - most of the times you have to try several times).

In most of the new builds in Hungary you can't chose your telecommunication company.
 
Thanks for the advice budapest & UrbanDev. Think I may just come and enjoy the city. Learnt today that the Ibiza development is by 'Elephant'and remembered the post about charging non residents 25% more. Old habits die hard.
Thought off plan would help my cash flow at the moment. Probably best just to come over and walk the streets for future reference. I would love a classical home close to the opera house. The opera house in London is my second home. Still we can dream.
Thanks again for your replies.
 
Take your time, balmpots. Have a good look around the city and figure out which areas you like and which you don't, particularly if it's going to be a second home as well as an investment. Streets within a stroll of the opera house such as Dalszinház utca, Paulay Ede utca, Székely Mihály utca, Kaldy Gyula utca and the Andrássy end of Hajos utca may suit you. Good apartments on these streets tend to be popular with both locals and international buyers alike as well as foreign tenants.
 
Balmpots it might be a good idea for you to meet up with Budapest. I found him invaluable when I was buying an apt over there. One like mine would suit you very well.....in fact I harbour a notion that I might go & live there myself someday. It's a beautiful city & full of culture.
 
Im coming over to Budapest 2nd week November - im intending to buy another apartment, got some agent appointments but I would really like some of your input Budapest.

Could we meet up - recommend a good place for a good meal and a few drinks one evening. More the merrier ....... exact date im uncertain of - flexible.

I got lucky ...... Ryan Air has just started doing flights from East Midlands airport and they did a fire sale on their website ........ bought lots of tickets ....... £8.99 return inc tax. So anyway ..... im coming over on the 7th for 6 days in November and would really like to meet some of you guys / gals.

Got a few locations to look at - Atrium development site and Sunrise Gardens / Dunbar park (depending whose selling). Would be interested in your insight.

Perplexed, I too could live there, - will you be around Budapest around those dates? As I said ...... the more the merrier.

Anyone had experience with one2one property?

Is it easy to flip property in Hungary? I had not thought of doing so ...... however an agent raised the prospect / suggested it, since Karolyi has sold so well - and I have one of the best apartments in the development.
 
MaxIII said:
Im coming over to Budapest 2nd week November - im intending to buy another apartment, got some agent appointments but I would really like some of your input Budapest.

Could we meet up - recommend a good place for a good meal and a few drinks one evening. More the merrier ....... exact date im uncertain of - flexible.

I got lucky ...... Ryan Air has just started doing flights from East Midlands airport and they did a fire sale on their website ........ bought lots of tickets ....... £8.99 return inc tax. So anyway ..... im coming over on the 7th for 6 days in November and would really like to meet some of you guys / gals.

Got a few locations to look at - Atrium development site and Sunrise Gardens / Dunbar park (depending whose selling). Would be interested in your insight.

Perplexed, I too could live there, - will you be around Budapest around those dates? As I said ...... the more the merrier.

Anyone had experience with one2one property?

Is it easy to flip property in Hungary? I had not thought of doing so ...... however an agent raised the prospect / suggested it, since Karolyi has sold so well - and I have one of the best apartments in the development.
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You can only flip when the market is rising significantly to cover your agents & legal costs of buying and selling otherwise why bother.

As there is practically no captial appreciation in budapest at present the chances of flipping are zero. Just because a developer/ agent says it has gone up in value agianst an earlier phase or against the market means nothing.
 
Have to agree with ringledman on this. Don't buy property in Budapest at the moment hoping to flip it quickly.

I think Budapest is still a good investment, but it's definetly a long term investment.

As for living here, it's a really big step. Budapest can be nice for a weekend, but living here isn't for everyone.
 
I've been here in BP for 4.5 yrs now from Ireland.
I've bought 2 places in that time after viewing >150 spots.
In my experience ~85% of the apartments on sale here have bad layout or dark. Of the remaining 15%, about 14% are overpriced.
Rental market in my experience is not great either.
I know some places that have been lying vacant for some time.
Your apartment needs to be something special in order to rent it easily.
(Which, given the bad layout of so many places here, is not hard)
I paid 666EUR/sqm and 733EUR/sqm in dist VIII and VII.
I wouldn't pay much more than that unless in a very good area - dist V, or Andrassy.
I find new builds are overpriced.

I agree flipping a place quickly here is probably not gonna be profitable.
You need to be in it for the long run.
 
ringledman said:
You can only flip when the market is rising significantly to cover your agents & legal costs of buying and selling otherwise why bother.

As there is practically no captial appreciation in budapest at present the chances of flipping are zero. Just because a developer/ agent says it has gone up in value agianst an earlier phase or against the market means nothing.
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I'm afraid MaxIII ended up with an agent who was good at selling him words. But remeber: when you work with an agent who promises what you want to hear, it often leads to stress, frustration and financial issues afterwards.
 
MaxIII said:
I too could live there
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Pomaz, here he comes ;)

"Hold out for Mad Max. This is his greatest adventure. A lone warrior searching for his destiny... in a world battling to survive, he faces a woman determined to rule. Two men enter, one man leaves. Welcome to Thunderdome!" Mad Max 3 - Film Poster
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Thanks budapest, Perplexed and all. Those street names have been highlighted. All Saints day will be my first full day in this city, Ryanair start on 31/10/07 and I am on the first of their flights out of Liverpool.
So long as no one tries to short change me in the shops I am sure the trip will be an enjoyable experience.
 
UrbanDev said:
Balmpots, if you like opera & ballet, also check out the Palace of Arts & National Theatre.

(The site is in Hungarian, English & German)
From 1-3 November, there's a performance by the French Canadian La La La Human Steps company, founded by choreographer Édouard Lock.
[broken link removed]

Here you can find some more info about the Palace of Arts:
[broken link removed]

Here you can see some pics of the Theatre:

http://www.csatolna.hu/hu/erdekes/CCapo/nemzeti/nemzeti.shtml

Have a great time in Budapest!
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thunder99 said:
Have to agree with ringledman on this. Don't buy property in Budapest at the moment hoping to flip it quickly.

I think Budapest is still a good investment, but it's definetly a long term investment.

As for living here, it's a really big step. Budapest can be nice for a weekend, but living here isn't for everyone.
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thunder99,

Whats it like to live there? I've always thought of making the move?
 
For all the ones out there having trouble with Autoker or other Budapest developers / agents, maybe this will make your day :rolleyes:

Client TestAmonials (sic)

I have been very well looked after by Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt and they had the complete package for me as in, Quality developments, good legal firm to work for me on my behalf, large experienced developer Autoker and overall made it hassle free for me buying in Hungary.

My apartments have been finished to a very high standard and Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt have been very helpful and reliable.

Damien Kelly
[broken link removed]
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We noticed the advertisement regarding property in Budapest in the office of Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt, Mullingar, and we were impressed with all of the information they gave us.

We read through the brochure and within one day we put a deposit on an apartment. We want to keep it long term as we feel that as it is near a business area the price of the property and the rental income will increase over the next few years.

We are very happy with the advice from Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt and the fact that they can organize the rental and management of the apartment in Hungary.

Veronica and Sean Mc Mullin
[broken link removed]
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I would be happy to say that when someone is considering purchasing a property abroad, it is very important to use an intermediary who can be trusted. I had no hesitation in trusting Pat Davitt and his team with the sourcing of a quality property in an upcoming part of Budapest, particularly since I was aware that Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt have been operating in Budapest for a good number of years now.

I was reassured by the fact that the developer was Autoker, who I was able to establish is one of the biggest developers in Hungary.

The whole purchase procedure has been extremely smooth, facilitated by the legal representation arranged on my behalf and I cannot praise the staff at Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt highly enough for efficiently answering queries I have raised from time to time.

George Stevenson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Stevenson
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My first contact with Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt was about 3 years ago at a Home Exhibition in Mullingar. I was a fellow exhibitor on a neighbouring stand, we got talking, I expressed an interest and I can honestly say from that day to the present it has been a pleasant and positive experience.

I bought two apartments from the plans in the Marina project district 13 of Budapest. I was taken through the whole process in a relaxed and professional manner. The entire team in Ireland and Hungary including the Legal Firm and the Management firm "ManageRent" were excellent.

We recently took a trip out to see the completion and I was shocked at the high standard of finish throughout by the developer Autoker.

I would definitely recommend Sherry FitzGerald Davitt & Davitt, I will use them again without hesitation.
Mr Ray Nugent
[broken link removed]
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More "testAmonials" on: www.davitteuproperty.com/testimonials.htm
 
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